Contract

[🪦 mperaginejr ●]

I know there have been a lot of problems lately with people getting ripped off, as in the past. Ever think of aking an artist, or offering a customer, a contract? My wife does freelance design work, and every project, from $15 to $3000 has a contract she sends people. Once my wise it up I am going to be sending signed contracts to anyone who places an order. Now I know, most of the time, the dollar amount is not something you'd take to court, but with a legal contract, it'd be something people would be less likely to try and snake someone on. Anyway, just a thought, I know its a hobby, but it is also a business.

[🪦 liquidaluminum ●]

Here's my thoughts on it if you don't mind. While I think it sounds like a good idea, the problem you're going to have is even with a contract, it's not going to really matter across state lines. If it were a high dollar item, then maybe, but for a two or three hundred dollar piece, even if you took it to court, they aren't going to do anything about it. Also, if I'm not mistaken, unless you have a business license, a contract doesn't mean anything. Another problem you're going to run into, is dealing with people across state / country lines, all they have to say is that it's not their sig on it or any number of things because there's no way to prove that the persons listed on the contract are the people who actually signed it. Please don't get me wrong though, I do think that it sounds like a great idea, but to anyone looking to rip you off, it's just going to be a piece of paper to sit a drink on. The smartest thing to do in this hobby anymore is to only accept money orders or cash. Personal checks are no good anymore because anyone can scam all day with those, and while I don't like PayPal, I use them all the time, and while they really do try to be fair, they mess up sometimes and get it wrong in the way of disputes. Money Orders or cash in hand is the only real guarantee these days, and above all else, just never send the item you're selling until you've got cash in hand. I feel for everyone that has gotten taken on here. I myself was taken on a glove that I bought from a kid who no longer comes to this forum. If I'm the seller of something, as much as it might make me look like a jerk to some, I will not send the item until I've either got the payment in my bank account, or whatever the trade was for reaches me first. If they don't want to work within those terms, then it's not a piece that I can't sell to someone else who does like to do honest business. I don't know though bro, I think your contract thing is worth trying at least. Let us know how it works out for you after a couple of sales if you don't mind.Good Luck,-Joseph

[🪦 Jasonlivessince1980 ●]

Agreed. It doesn't make you look like a jerk to demand payment before product is delivered however... the person offering the service dictates the terms of service in almost every business transaction you will ever be a part of. Trust, of course, is of utmost importance with any transaction, and its particularly important with the kind of stuff we do in the collecting community, but a little skepticism is healthy <img src=\"style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thumbsup.gif\" style=\"vertical-align:middle\" emoid=\":thumbsup:\" border=\"0\" alt=\"thumbsup.gif\" />

[🪦 ReellyScary ●]

PayPal is a great way to guarantee you'll either get what you paid for or get your money back. As long as your open and have nothing to hide and your <b>HONEST</b>.......I've found PayPal as a great way to protect yourself. One safe guard I've adopted is to make sure what your paying for is ready to ship or within PayPal's limit to file a claim...FIGURES....MODELS ...etc. Each Seller that accepts PayPal should know they have a deadline to meet. Just keep that in mind if your gonna sell something.Other than Blacklisting IP Numbers....I can't think of a better way of sorting the "bad from"good".Other than that...it's hit or miss, I guess.

[🪦 scabboy ●]

You can use that contract in small claims court, legalities aside you can always sue civilly. For instance, I see people getting sued across state lines all the time on TV (Craigslist, eBay, etc), no business license, just a contract (verbal, legal, non-legal [i.e. an email]).You can sue someone for not raking your yard if you paid them to do so, just as long as you have a contract.I think a contract would be a great idea, especially when it comes to turnaround time. I don't mind waiting extra, but it sort of sucks when you are told "a few weeks" and it ends up being six months.

[🪦 Sinister ●]

I love the idea!

[🪦 Deadguy71 ●]

Seems like most willfull fraud would occur whether there is a contract or not. Ebay set-up to be a contract, and so is paypal. Send an invoice through Paypal, (or receive one) and you've got the same protection that a contract would offer.The only truly safe way to do it is in-person, or thru escrow.A "small claims" type escrow service would be awesome. If I'm buying a mask, I could pay the escrow service, and the seller won't get money until their item is received in escrow. Of course for many mask makers sellers, they're using the money you send to actually make the product, so escrow (or in-person cash transactions) wouldn work for them if they need that money up-front.The problem with Paypal is that it doesn't truly document shipping.. there's no way to know if an item is truly in a package or not, but as long as it's used correctly.. (ie- ship only to a registered address, get tracking, get insurance, and use within their time constraints) you are about as safe as you're going to get with a long distance transaction.Paypal is safe as hell for the buyer, but less so for the seller. A buyer may claim that something arrived damaged, or a box arrived empty, and there's little you can do to fight that except in small claims, and even there, it's a risk that you won't be able to prove the item changed hands because it turns into a he-said,she-said argument.However, Paypal WILL stick up for the seller if they get "paypal protection" on their sales, and follow the guidelines they stipulate.. At that point, your reputation of good business through PayPal will help you. That's another reason I wont deal out-of-country unless I have great trust in the receiving party; it's too easy to file a weird unenforceable claim that will not only rip you off, but stays on record as YOU performing a bad trade, which can look bad for your case when a dispute arises.

[🪦 Indica x ●]

When I comissioned a higher end piece from Colin Mayne he drew up a little contract for us. However with a piece around 200-300 you're still kind of alone if you know what I mean. Small claims court is an option however over state lines thats a bit tricky too. At the very least the contract can serve as a piece of mind type thing to your customer.